So apparently this newest Glee episode gave me ~feelings~

[ravelqueen]

 

Uh yeah, I actually only set out to write an episode reaction, but instead it turned into a longwinded meta analysis of the David - Kurt relationship...Idek

So if anyone is interested in it, my thoughts on it, based on todays episodes, meaning, massive spoilers for "Heart" under the cut as well as a disclaimer, that I'm not a Kurtofsky shipper, but I don't hate on anyones preferences and I hope you will extend me the same curtesies ;)

The reactions to those two seem to be mixed between “YAY Kurtofsky should happen, Blaine sucks” and “NO Kurtofsky is an abomination, urgh, they shouldn't even talk Klaine forever!” and mhm there doesn’t seem to be much middle ground? I don’t know if that’s normal for this fandom, but it suprises me a bit.

Because I’m really in the middle ground. I love Klaine, I think they are adorable and I ship them like mad. At some points it was hard, because lots of Blaines character developement is very much between-the-lines, but we are getting more and more of it (actually a reason why I liked s2 “Silly love songs”, BiotA and Sexy so much, because we saw some actual character traits on Blaine).

And while I like the Karofsky character and what they did with him AND him being the secret admirer in this episode I could never, ever ship them. And while I think the writers did an excellent job today in illustrating just why that is, I’m apparently passionate enough in this subject to want to add my own two cents^^.

Please be aware that this is 1) my own opinion and interpretations of the story-line and characters, you can agree or disagree, but please no flaming 2)I will talk a bit (and I mean a bit) about sexual assault/harrassement later on, so if anyone would be triggered by that please be warned.

David Karofsky

I totally buy that David has a crush on Kurt, I would even go so far as saying that Kurt was probably responsible for his sexual awakening so to speak. He was the reason David figured out he was gay in the first place. After he finally stopped hating himself so much those feelings matured. But, I’m actually with Kurt on this one, I don’t think it is more than that. He admires Kurt for his bravery and he was probably one of the first guys David found himself attracted to and he is the person David projects much of his rehabiliation from a bully on.

With this I mean, that ,as we saw in “Prom Queen”, David feels unspeakably guilty for his actions. The after all stemmed from self-hatred/insecurity and all of it makes him feel like a horrible person. Kurt forgiving him and being understanding validates him in a way as being a “nice guy” again.

In a way, getting Kurt to like or love him would at once absolve him, endorse him and help him in really figuring out his identity as a homosexual man.

That doesn’t mean he doesn’t geniunely like Kurt. I think he absolutely does. I’m sure he admires his positive qualities. In addition this was the first person he could be really honest with. That knew him in a way no-one else did.

But all of that is a horribly bad foundation for an actual relationship, because it puts Kurt on a very high pedestal and makes him the symbol for a lot of things David aspires to be. Again, if all those episodes in which Blaine acted like an idiot/was insensitive/made mistakes hadn’t happened I don’t think I would support them as much, because it made the characters too unequal in their regard in its the same thing here.

But even supposing all of that wasn’t true and not a problem there is the other part of the equation:

Kurt Hummel

And boy, would that be a trainwreck and make me very afraid of Kurts state of mind, mental health and self esteem.

Because while Kurt may have only been good for David the exact opposite of that is true in the reverse. As Kurt said so succinctly he bullied him, terrified him, made him leave his school and with that his social environment only to get away from him. Kurt was always aware that life wasn’t fair and especially not to people like him, but in a way he still had the childlike innocence and deep seated surety, that while people may not like him, he was safe.

And David’s actions more than any other took that away from him. And he may have changed and he may have had his reasons and he may be repentant, but that doesn’t change the fact that he not only physically assaulted him, but he also terrorized him psychologically and sexually.

I wasn’t in the fandom at that time, so I don’t know how much meta there was about it, but it is very clear from his reaction that that kiss was the reason Kurt just couldn’t stay at that school anymore. While physical violence is horrible and destructive as well, sexual violence happens at such a deeper, visceral level. It is something so closely bound to your self-image, self esteem and personal safety, because it is so much more intimate, that a violation of your personal space is felt so much deeper.

Having this instinctive trust and assurance, that you choose your intimate encounters taken away from you, changes a person forever. Just look at accounts of sexual harrassment/abuse victims. Even if as some people like to trivialize “nothing real happened” (which urgh it makes me sick even to write it, anything that makes you uncomfortable in a situation with another person is “real”!) it sticks with you. You jump at things you normally wouldn’t, you may have more problems with intimacy, tread more carefully in certain situations than before.

All of this happened to Kurt and while he dealt with it and is over it, made his peace with it, he will never forget, when he lost this last assurance that his world is safe. And the reason is David Karofsky. Him actually getting into a relationship with a person with whom he has such an abusive background would be horrifying.

He can never truly trust David, will never truly, honestly, deeply feel safe with him and that in the end is the death sentence for any relationship.

I don’t mean to offend anyone, shipping is shipping and everyone is entitled to their own personal interpretations. If you see it, it is there for you and I would never try to take that enjoyment from anyone. I can definitevely see a friendship developing between them, that would be beneficial for both parties. But for me, a romantic relationship would be dysfunctional at best and dangerously unhealthy at worst.

Comments

[mimiheart]

You've hit the nail on the head for me as to why I can't ship Karofsky in anything but an AU where NBK didn't happen. This relationship isn't just uncomfortable for some viewers. It's actually triggering. You're talking sexual assault. And if you watch Karofsky and Kurt's relationship in NBK and Furt and you're wearing slash goggles for them, it's abusive. (Well, it's abusive anyhow, but if they're a romantic pair, it's... *shudder*.) Karofsky threatened to kill Kurt. This isn't a, "Oh, well, forgive and forget and move on, and go off into the sunset." thing. That man wasn't spewing words. He has the ability to do it and has done other physical and sexual things to Kurt before. Psychological scars run deep.

Now, is this something that could theoretically be explored? Yes. But not in a comedic setting. Not in a romantic way. Any shipping between them, I don't think, can be done with fluff and comedy in mind. At least not unless you go fifteen, twenty years in the future... without them having any contact in between. Let them both grow up, see where they go. It certainly not something that can be explored on Glee as it stands now.

My biggest issue with Karofsky returning now is that I don't think it does his or Kurt's or Blaine's characters any good. His character has served its purpose. His storyline has ended. I don't think it needed to come back. There are other characters around that NEED stories explored better. Other characters that, if spoilers are true, could use that or similar storylines. Why bring this guy back? Why open this box?

(I say all of this as someone who likes Max Adler a lot. I like the Karofsky character as an abstract--I think he's interesting, but I hate a lot of what he's done. I thought the character needed closure at the end of last season. He got it with "The First Time.")

[ravelqueen]

Yes, like if NBK had never happened while I will still forever be a Klaine shipper, because I like everyone have a crush on Darren, it would at least make sense. It could even be interesting, because in a way Kurt is in a way to Karofksy what Blaine was to Kurt at that time - a mentor like figure, where he can find acceptance and support. So that idea even has merit and is an interesting role change.

But the moment Daves desperation turned to violence all fluffy thoughts about that are gone. While angsty or horribly depressing or un-requited once still make sense, anything else would be horribly OOC

His character has served its purpose. His storyline has ended. I don't think it needed to come back.

Honestly? I think that was absolutely a schedule decision. They knew the fans would kill them if Kurt didn't have a valentines day subplot (unrelated to Finchel anyway, because yes he could have had dinner with all the other ones, but it wouldn't have been his story-line) and Darren wasn't around to provide.

Just taking any other person as a secret admirer would be problematic, especially as they would have needed to introduce another character. And Max Adler has a lot of fans that had been demanding him back AND Murphy & co have repeatedly said that they wanted other people trying to intrude on the Kurt/Blaine dynamic.

So while I agree with you that other storylines, would have made more sense/would have been more necessary, "Glee" tries very hard sometimes to please it fans (in a very schizophrenic way....like sometimes too much and sometimes doing the exact opposites) and this was the only storyline they could do logistically and that at least made some logical sense

[(Anonymous)]

As for Klaine/Kurtofsky-- outside of Glee, I'm a Snarry shipper. Snape/Harry. Because that doesn't have any possibility of being triggering or anything... I think the difference between Snarry shipping and Kurtofsky shipping is that if you asked people who ship Snarry what we think of our pairing, most of us recognize that, well, it's NOT anything that ever would have been a canon possibility. Oh, yeah, we're totally writing JKR and demanding Snape and Harry hook up in the next book -- uh huh. But Snape is such FUN to play with. We know that Snape's a snarky asshole. We know Snape had power over Harry in very real ways for a very long time. We know that that dynamic either has to change or be addressed for that relationship to even resemble something healthy. Or we explore an unhealthy relationship with the power dynamic as it stands in the first five or six books.

With Kurtofsky, from what I've seen, and I admit I haven't looked a lot because of what I've seen, either it's not addressed or it's not known. There were a few fics on the angst meme that I saw that did adress it, but they were angst meme prompts where the prompter showed how the dynamic wasn't fluffy kittens and rainbows. Even last night on FFrants, someone ranted about a Kurtofsky fic where Karofsky took advantage of a drunk Kurt, and once Kurt had it explained to him that he consented when he was drunk enough to BLACK OUT, he was fine with it. The author and reviewers all didn't see what was wrong with this. That bothers me and scares me. These, mostly girls, don't see the problem.

They could have done the Secret Admirer storyline with Kurt being oblivious and having Blaine BE the Secret Admirer. They don't need to introduce Karofsky again.

And I disagree about them trying to please their fans. How many people have been asking for Karofsky back vs. asking for a Tina storyline. Or for Tina to... well, exist at all? It really isn't a WHOLE lot to ask. They're trying to introduce drama into a comedy show. This show's biggest problem is too many characters and not enough time. And we have Joe Hart. And Rory. And Sugar. And Nene whats hername. And And And. We have enough characters. Let's develop the ones we have, work with them... we can introduce drama with them... Kurt and Blaine can even fight without having others involved in their relationship. I know it's possible. Lots of people do it.